Her mother was married to my uncle. And she called 911. In one entry, she writes that she has plans for people who have messed with her, and that "people will be surprised of what she is capable of," Caledonia County State's Attorney Lisa Warren said. From my point of view, the American police investigations are first hand, and often very poorly done, Ive only seen worse in the British police, which is paradoxical given the laudatory talent of both nationalities, but it is a Scandinavian saying: bigger the mouth, smaller the facts. He was captured in August and is in state custody. On Alexs diaper bag, police found strands of the same type of hair from the car. A newspaper account described Patricia as a soft-spoken, demure woman who had a sweet Southern accent and wore feminine clothes in court. The woman who was showing the home alleged that Patricia was involved in the theft. (Ross Township Police Department). And your contention that you (me) as ONE person are wrong, let me say that while you seem to be determined in singling me out as someone whos opinion is one against the rest, is hopelessly exaggerated. On June 14, 1989, Patricia Wright and her 7-year-old son, Alfey, were riding in a car driven by family friend Lawrence Slaughter. And your attempt to draw a distinction between a fact and an opinion! He gave an audio interview to the Wrong Man investigators when they made a surprise visit to his house, but he declined to appear on camera. So whats your point (other than many people are stupid and you arent)? She likely SUFFOCATED him to get revenge on the babys father who was planning on leaving her. I dont see any defining comment or wording that justifies that claim. Patricia McCloskey pleaded guilty to misdemeanor harassment and was fined $2,000, while Mark admitted to misdemeanor fourth-degree Follow her on Twitter at www.twitter.com/LizMurraySMC. Were suppose to ignore the actual forensic evidence and forensic opinions because we were told that a cop overheard her claiming she confessed? "It's been a long time coming for the family and the community," Warren said. At 17, Patricia dropped out of high school and married landscaper Gary Gabard. They told him that if he testified against his sister, Patricia, he would be able to get out of prison sooner. Joann Katrinaks Killer Still Has Innocence Advocates(A Woman Scorned, Forensic Files). The couple moved into Andrews sturdy brick house at 740 Front Street in Catasauqua, Pennsylvania. Under supervision of a doctor, 39 hair specimens were removed, recorded and logged. I thought the same. WebTexas-born Patricia ("Tissie) Said, formerly of the Owens family, is the mother who lured her two teenage daughters, Sarah and Amina, to their deaths at the hands of their own father But I suppose you havent a clue about that. A person tried in a court of law and then found guilty is not the be-all and end-all to the case. An infant was lying face down on her stomach. "As horrible as Ms. Jenkins death was, it should stand for something," Marsicovetere said. His father confirmed his alibi that they were doing construction work together, putting an addition on the house of friends Tom and Kathy Holschwander, at the time of Joanns disappearance. OK my GUESS is Patricia did do it! What they reported to us is that she came into their care in 1999 where she was found in need, in the streets in Puerto Rico, where she had been wandering around. She embraced spontaneity and diligence. A man normally wouldnt care about killing a child, but a woman normally would have some kind of abhorrence to harming an innocent child. Keep in mind that 34 hairs are in custody of the state police, so where are the other 4 hairs? This article can also be seen at crimereport.com. Why would she say that maybe she wasnt really a good friend, just someone trying to inject herself into a super sensational case. Relatives at the time told cops that Yaser threatened bodily harm against Sarah for going on a date with a non-Muslim. That's counting the nine bullets you put in Sarah. Roughly nine months ago, Interpol contacted the police department that kept her file open. They retested the hair for DNA evidence with updated technology definitely Patricias hair case closed. in journalism from the University of Southern California. Theres a similar air of confusion connected to the Scott Peterson debacle. Oh wait, sorry, you werent there. It showed her usually all-brown hair haphazardly highlighted blond. (A good point. You can PM me please, this way you can update your article with the correct information. If the answer is no, enough said! Ms. According to Arletta Wright, Patricia needs to be driven because she has been legally blind since the age of 16. After her arraignment, she had to walk past a crowd of dozens of locals screeching hang her! and baby killer! Patricia clung to a Polaroid picture showing her and her own little girl. Any subsequent proof emerging and then revealed in a book or documentary is surely something that should be taken seriously and investigated if necessary. The evidence was all there. I would have liked better her being put to death! Yes, that doesnt mean shes unquestionably guilty, but it does mean her case has been relatively exhaustively examined (and its not over) and it means that your assertion that you are right and the guilty camp are wrong (and that this should be obvious) is absurdly overplayed. But defense lawyer Robert Pfeiffer said that plenty of evidence supported Patricias innocence. WebIn burst a group of men and women with their guns drawn. Shame on your for defending a vicious killer. The police report misspells his name (Troutman) and doesnt include his address, suggesting authorities didnt want anyone to track him down, according to Patricias side. Which, for this very reason, is at present being investigated by a federal judge? Its definitely getting rougher every day, Andrew told the Morning Call. They were not reported until 5:30 the next morning and he had already spliced the phone lines together. Thank you Kerry. As I stated previously, if she cannot speak for herself, Im happy to step up on her behalf. I didnt read anything in this article that convinced me I didnt like that the lab had a bad rep and I do agree the police lie and frame people sometimes so I cant say 100% she did it or not. Browns downtown Los Angeles office demanding that he grant Patricia Wright clemency. In North Carolina, she reportedly enjoyed some success as a horse trader, riding instructor, and rodeo competitor. They also found a photo of Patricia taken 11 days before the homicide. If you want to help her let her find peace by admitting her wrong and asking God for forgiveness. And the obvious answer is not as you claim. Its never been made clear. No charmed life. The author that wrote the book on the Rutier case donates all the funds from that book to freeing Darlie Routier because the jury wasnt shown a lot of evidence of the medical issues Darlie suffered. I comment on these forums because they are the only places offering the opportunity to, hopefully, bring awareness to those whore unfamiliar with this case and her unfair plight. Shes just extremely happy with Andy, her brother, Michael OConnor, told the media. And the obvious answer is not as you claim. Patricia Prue had been planning to use an insanity defense if the case were to go to trial, but she asked the court in December if she could change her plea so she could begin corresponding with her husband once again. She had had numerous run-ins with the police and, each time, would tell them to be ready because the end of the world was coming. That, as well as measurements of the babys head (revealing the infant to be of a more advanced age) very much suggest they were killed some considerable time after what was believed at her trial. Barry Grube, one of the few, if not only, police officers sympathetic to Patricias cause, noted that Andrew didnt seem particularly frantic while authorities searched desperately for his wife and son. But let me say in my defence, I have not attacked anyone on this particular site with outright rudeness, to which you allude, albeit some of them deserved a retort of some substance. The LAPD alleged that Patricias motive was to get Jeromes insurance money, which had a value of $30,000. Lie detectors are pseudo science. Patricia Owens, But her reputation wasnt exactly sleek and shiny. Interesting thought about the alibi timing. "Clive was a skilful and inventive actor with wide experience, as his successful career proved," she said. Suzanne Pearson fabricated quotes from Patricia including her claim that Patricia said, Im going to the electric chair upon her arrest because a conviction would boost Pearsons career. The missing hairs probably got destroyed in testing.. thats how they test them.. and reports are wrong all the time. She didnt kill those two boys and TX knows, but they made too much noise about it, hence this is probably the real reason that Darlie hasnt been put to death 24-25 yrs later. Patricia Prue's lawyer Brian Marsicovetere told the court on Friday that his client was "severely mentally ill," and that the case should be used as an example for why the state should focus on developing a strong mental health system. THE COPS SET HER UP. Through that testing, the elderly patient was confirmed to be the same woman locally known in Pittsburgh as a street preacher called The Sparrow who vanished and left her family flummoxed. Marsicovetere cited studies done by several doctors during pretrial proceedings, saying that they determined Patricia Prue suffered from post-traumatic stress disorder and might suffer from dissociative identity disorder as well. However, that first theory very neatly allows the cops to further theorise that the gun she once owned (which had a history of jamming after the first shot) was the one used at the murder. Patricia also pointed out that when author Tammy Mal started her research and speaking to me, she was not an advocate at all but she reversed and ended up advocating for Patricias innocence. This FBI report, of the hairs being unable to yield a DNA result because of the absent root material, was never revealed to Rorrers defence. . The teens were found shot multiple times in a cab outside an Irving motel after one of them called 911, saying she was dying, authorities said. . The jury deliberated for three hours after Thursday's closing arguments. As for the words exchanged on the call between the two big-haired women, Joann told Andrew that Patricia had used profanity; Patricia said it was the other way around. Flawed justice: the wrongful conviction of Kerry Baxter Sr. In a million years, she wouldnt do anything to harm that.. You people are fighting a losing cause! And then in their zealous efforts to show their ire, feel the need to suggest anyone who supports her is deluded.. Now retired, he declined ForensicFilesNow.coms invitation to spar directly with Patricia via a podcast. It's been a long three years for them.". He wanted to move to Colorado and she was against it.. I have to wake up every morning with the freedom that God gave me knowing that my sister is incarcerated for life and that my lies put her there, Larry wrote in a letter to the LAPD after he had been freed. Irving Police Chief Jeff Spivey hailed authorities for pursuing justice in the case for more than a decade. "The family has been very patient. Keep her murdering ass locked up!!! Shock, Gloria Smith, the sister of the lost-and-found woman, said at the press conference. Then international law enforcement was contacted. I most definitely will not personally afford Patricia a platform, Michael said in an email to ForensicFilesNow.com She had her chance to answer my questions and tell her story in court over 20 years ago. Or did they? She said that she has no idea why her ex-husband killed her daughters. At 17, Patricia dropped out of high school and married landscaper Gary Gabard. She was wrongfully convicted.. He was sentenced Said to life in prison without the possibility of parole. We should be skeptical of those, like you, who suggest its obvious a jury got it wrong that you know better than 12 people presented with the evidence. I would like to tell you that there is many errors in this article, that I would love to send to you the proof of each one. I think we need to realize that each dollar we spend or don't spend could have a serious impact on our society and our safety.". Yassein Said, 59, is guilty of conspiring to hide his older brother, Yaser Said, as authorities sought him in connection with the New Years Day slayings. After researching this case more thoroughly, I stand corrected about the time it took the jury to return a verdict. At one point, Owens looked directly at Said and reminded him of all of the abuse they endured, allegedly having a knife pulled on her. Instead, he hid for 12 years until the FBI found him in a relatives home in Denton County. Patricias accusers theorized that she resented Joanns domestic bliss with the tall, athletic Andrew Katrinak. Check out ALL the facts if you feel the need to comment. If you subscribe to Hulu and upgrade to Starz (theres a free one-week trial offer), you can stream the Wrong Man episodes about Patricia Rorrer. A man was convicted Thursday of helping to hide a brother who was accused of murdering his teenage daughters in Irving more than 12 years ago, the U.S. Attorneys Office announced. During Patricias hours-long turn in the witness chair, Michael McIntyre grilled her relentlessly. And even prosecutor Michael McIntyre, who wrote the book Hair Trigger about the case, acknowledged to Keith Morrison that it was a little odd that the police found blood on the hairs in Joanns car but nowhere else in the vehicle. It makes me sick. Another inaccuracy in this is, they state the jury took SIX HOURS to return a verdict, when in fact it took less than TWO HOURS. The men harbored Yaser Said inside an apartment in Bedford, according to court documents, and he was nearly captured after a maintenance worker spotted him in August 2017. Patricia Prue to undergo 2nd competency exam, Your California Privacy Rights / Privacy Policy. Mark and Patricia McCloskey, the St. Louis couple that infamously pointed guns at demonstrators who were marching past their house last summer, have pleaded guilty to misdemeanor charges in the incident. Curiously after this latest test, the 39 hairs removed only 34 were accounted for what became of the absent 4 hairs? I was like OK, maybe she was tired, you know with a new baby. Three days later, Joann had plans to pick up her mother-in-law, Veronica Katrinak, to go Christmas shopping. And when Patricia was taken into custody where they removed 39 hairs with root, and then all of a sudden after the FBI report say that the hair tested had NO ROOT ATTACHED, the hair tested had a root? Ive heard she gets to go out to LUNCH and this broad is in prison for murdering her husband Russ Stager? The women testified last week. and there are probably many people who still think he is innocent too. simply to create an atmosphere of hatred towards a person who, in all probability, has been wrongfully imprisoned. Sticking to a promise he made before the pair pleaded guilty, the Republican governor announced Tuesday that Mark and Patricia McCloskey were among 12 people granted pardons on Friday. In pleading guilty, Islam Said admitted that evidence proved he committed the crimes charged in the superseding indictment filed in November 2020. The only record of a call from Patricia to the Katrinak household was on 12/7/94. So where they alive somewhere, and if so how could of Patricia, who was questioned, with not one mark on her kill them? I am reliably informed they took SIX hours, not TWO as stated in my comment. Allen Prue maintains that he is innocent, and he has appealed his conviction to the Vermont Supreme Court. Disagree with Patricia Kopta eventually developed dementia, police said. And Patricia did live in another state. Bully for you if youve read a lot and seen a lot: its meaningless to other posters and adds nothing to your argument for innocence. Soon after, Kopta lost her job because she was seeing things and her behavior was disruptive, and then she began to walk the streets to spread her message. Hoist by your own petard. A Pennsylvania woman who went missing more than 30 years ago in a case that stumped authorities who later declared her legally dead has been found living in a nursing home in Puerto Rico. in emerging media and communication from the University of Texas at Dallas and an M.S. In TV clips, Andrew didnt come off as anguished. They depict scenes which are pure speculation or exaggeration or present scenes, which in fact were only theories mentioned at her trial. New state, new man. Anyway, there are thousands of people who differ from that belief, that is why there is so much controversy surrounding this case, and that is why there have been numerous convicted people in the past whove been exonerated on appeal. She made an effort to look perfectly groomed even when she took out the trash, according to her mother, who appeared on Forensic Files. The witness, Traupman, who on several occasions attempted to have his evidence recorded was severely manhandled out of the police station and so badly beaten, he had to be hospitalised. There was a blood-stained fingernail and hair found on the victims body, and even though (in Keith Morrisons Dateline documentary) the Asst. Police theorize she owned the gun, but its neither here nor there whether she used a particular gun to kill and would make sense (to a wise perp) that the gun couldnt be linked to her by past activity. She should have been treated exactly the way she treated that mother and baby, taken out into the woods, shot, beaten and then left to die. There was widespread speculation that the sisters were shot in an honor killing a practice in some cultures in which men kill female relatives who are thought to have brought shame upon their families. I finally had to stop reading this stupid article. But I agree with a recent comment.. Why not do a paternity case so just that is done and out of the way. She definitely did it. I hope she suffers and goes insane from loneliness. Said showed no emotion as the verdict was read. Sad discovery. Nobody said bodies were intact. Its nine minutes into the video. Then 31 years old, she had lived a rocky existence. However, Said never called 911. The prosecution alleged that Patricia called the Katrinaks house from a pay phone in Pennsylvania. Perhaps youre not aware, there was a great deal of evidence of which these documentaries made no mention, as well as misdeeds and incidents of corruption perpetrated by the cops. Yet they insisted in the trial that the call came in on the 13th. You are not expressing an opinion but making an assertion or claim of fact: [I] have absolutely no doubt she was railroaded and wrongfully convicted. You are claiming innocence as fact there is no doubt shes innocent. SHAME ON THEM. Very similar. Yaser Abdel Said, 63, was arrested Wednesday by agents in the small town of Justin, about 36 miles northwest of Dallas, officials said. I wonder, did they ever perform a DNA test on the baby, to verify paternity? The first rule of a murder is motive. Just consider all your nasty posts about others opinions and learn to attack the argument, not the arguer with insults. She is a D-FW native with a B.A. Murder in Lehigh Valley: Keith Morrison Reports, The Lindbergh Kidnapping: Forensic Files Lost Episode, Dawn Fehring: A Missionary Dies Too Young, Joanne Chambers and Paula Nawrocki: Strange Lesson. I dont understand Partricias defenders pointing to Andrew with the dyed blond hair found at the car and murder scene. So we can just pretend that everyone is honest all of the time? I believe this woman murdered Joann and Alex. The state police dropped him as a suspect. Patricias defenders also say Andrew Katrinak staged the scene at his house by prying the door and cutting the phone line. The reason Interpol was involved is because all three had different European citizens, as a result of which it was very difficult to follow the thread of the event. Andrew described his existence with Joanne and Alex as a little Camelot., Ex-spouse off list. Your email address will not be published. All my comments have been vetted and approved by this sites organisers so how do you see yourself as the judge of whats acceptable or not? You say by definition! One on one? You seem to have a fragile ego. According to Kohlhepp, the RTPD obtained Patricia Koptas DNA sample, then obtained one from her sister and a nephew. Shes being well taken care of.. I wanted to get out of there.. She had a history of violence over men, and she had access to the dump site from frequent visits. There are a number of issues in the case, Kelley said in a letter to his associate, Christopher Darden, including the competency of counsel, prosecutorial misconduct and, of course, compelling legal error by the court.. While Patricia does not qualify for medical parole, she can still file for executive clemency or compassionate release, which she has already done and which was met with more resistance from Gov. The difference was made by the investigation, Interpol has some good detectives who do not play with peoples freedom and who do not use American techniques such as pictures, lets compare hair color after pictures bullshit, not even with the performance of todays cameras such a thing is not allowed, the issue of dismantling the alibi only with indirect evidence, like that her name was not in the notebook, a European court would withdrew it immediately, you cant go with a thing like this, its called inconclusive proof, even the fact that one of the witnesses said that the business was not opened where she said it was that day, its inconclusive, the accused can say that he/she forgot, was there and left, and his alibi I dont know how it was verified, but what should been verified first were the contacts between him and her, if he contacted her before that, if she had been contacted from public phone for example before the murder, how many times, when etc, if he was near the places where she was until the murder, things like that. Ironically its you who is basing your view on second-hand information, as you were not in court. More hairs there. WebAmina and Sarah Said were murdered by their father Yaser Abdul Said an Egyptian immigrant on January 1st 2008. Because of these two prior offences, Patricia was sentenced to life in prison without possibility of parole under Californias Three Strikes Law. Why not question some of this evidence? His defense team raised concerns about what they considered a lack of evidence during closing arguments. Her alibi about going to the club, called Cowboys Nitelife, got fuzzy when investigators discovered she hadnt signed the guest book on that day. She has always denied this allegation and says that both she and Lawrence Slaughter are innocent. Her diary certainly indicates some disturbed thinking. ALL IT THEN BECOMES IS A SOURCE OF INACCURACIES AND SPECULATION, WHICH ONLY SERVES TO BOLSTER THOSE WITH THAT MENTALITY AND PERPETUATE THE LACK OF TRUTH. Family members found Joanns tan Toyota sitting vacant in the parking lot of McCartys, a nearby bar. "You knew how the Patricia pled guilty on April 2, 1990. They theorize that Andrew Katrinak framed Patricia and that the hostile phone call between Patricia and Joann actually took place not on Dec. 12 as Andrew said but rather on Dec. 7. Forensic tests suggested the hair found in the car and at the murder scene came from Patricia. Once, when a gun-wielding farmer and his buddy caught Patricia and Gary riding motorcycles on his field, Patricia walked up and got in their faces and argued, Gary recalled to the Morning Call. 2023 FOX Television Stations, Rockwall-Heath coach resigns after school workout investigation, Things to do this weekend in Dallas-Fort Worth: March 3-5, Dallas 14, 15-year-olds charged with murder, Prosper man who shot neighbor's pit bull will not face charges, Watch: New video from Hubble space telescope captures asteroid-smashing debris from successful DART mission, New street drug 'tranq dope,' rots skin, turns humans into 'zombies', 3 children killed, 2 hurt in Italy, Texas, Biden has cancerous skin lesion removed from chest, doctor says, Severe weather video and photos from around North Texas, Suspected North Texas scented candle thieves allegedly stole $27,774 worth of items. I am sorry it ever happened at all.". Proven in court and sentence awarded!!! It fails to mention the car was totally clean of any other forensic residue. There was a blood-stained fingernail and hair found on the victims body, and even though (in Keith Morrisons Dateline documentary) the Asst. They were there in the winter months in which the bodies would have been frozen most of the time. Patricia defaulted on her mortgage and then returned to North Carolina, where she eventually moved in with a boyfriend named Brian Ward. I made the confession on tape that I had rehearsed with the LAPD, said Larry Wright. The phone wire was located at the opposite end of the basement, which was dark. Before Said was taken away, he heard two victim impact statements. No Jail Time for Former Corrections Officer and Friend Who Together Breached the U.S. Capitol on Jan. 6. Shes where she belongs in prison for the rest of her life. In recent years, she began to share key details about her past life in Pittsburgh to nursing home staff that led them to investigate. The longer it took to find the bodies the easier it would be for her alibis to be believed as it wouldve been harder for people to remember if she was at a dance class etc that she regularly attended on that specific date. She is a tough one, Sheriff Gerald Hege would later tell the Morning Call in a June 29, 1997 interview. So, lets take your response one step at a time. because theres money to be made from the commercials added into their show. Sorry ladiesher hair was in the car and at the scene.she murdered them. I had five children to take care of and it was costing me so much money to travel two hours I believe the answer to your question is in my comment above. Despite the fact it has never been proved thats exactly how it happened, it seems to be accepted as fact it could just as possibly have been the other way round, beaten and then shot. Within about seven months of Larry being placed in a maximum-security prison, the LAPD paid him a visit. Well, at least you managed some sense there when you say that, especially when you take into account the amount of evidence and witnesses which were withheld from the Defence and what appears to be a clear case of evidence-tampering. They returned with a guilty verdict and a sentence of two life terms. Both wanted to be doctors. The article also notes that most inmates earn around 19 cent an hour at their jobs and must pay $5 each time they need medical attention or medicine. It cost me a lot of money, I even put advertisements in the paper down in Puerto Rico looking for her.. It wasnt aimed at any one video producer. The only thing that has changed since this case is the ability of people to access and proclaim crackpot ideas, conspiracies, and all the rest. I have never seen anything this egregious in all my years.. We lived close to one another. I dont even know its Christmas.. Great communicator. Looking at the pictures of the scene, after 4 months of the bodies being there allegedly, they were untouched? Yassein Saids sentencing has been set for June 4. A few fries short of a Happy Meal, that one. True, Andrew would have no way to acquire and plant Patricias blond hair there because it wasnt that color when she knew him. Traupman claimed that when he reported the dispute, trooper Robert V. Egan III got mad and practically kicked him out of his office. Addressing Patricia Prue, Judge Robert Bent said the sentence of life without parole was "fitting" since she was a full participant in the crime. WebPatricia Lynne Rorrer made for a good suspect. "This is the 13th case solved after the creation of the cold case task force," said El Dorado County District Attorney Vern Pierson. A person tried in a court of law and then found guilty is not the be-all and end-all to the case. At that time he was living in Connecticut. If you look at the crime scene picture, only parts of the mother seem preserved. Dont know from where youve got your information about this case my guess is youve been watching a lot of those documentaries which revel in showing the case in a disgracefully biased manner. The hearing of the motion for reduction of felony to misdemeanor will be held Tuesday, Oct. 11, at 1:30 p.m. in the Riverside Courthouse at 4050 Main St. in Department 42. They depict scenes which are pure speculation or exaggeration or present scenes, which in fact were only theories mentioned at her trial. no blood, no finger-prints and no soil evidence it was as if the car had been wiped clean stated the attending investigating police officer!That itself has to be considered highly suspicious and cast doubt on the hair evidence which WAS found.